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MIDI Cymbal Choke

PostPosted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 11:37 am
by nickynoodles
Aerodrums is working great with Superior drummer, but I can't seem to get the cymbal choke zones to send any midi.

I'm included to believe it's just not implemented at the moment. Is that right? There's no mention here

If not, you can guess the next question :) ... any plans to?

Re: MIDI Cymbal Choke

PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 10:58 am
by Richard
You're correct, choking cymbals isn't supported yet in MIDI mode. This feature was labelled 'experimental' in our release notes because, of the various ideas we had to support choking, it wasn't clear which was the best. We wanted to see what our users thought about it before committing to it and adding support for MIDI, etc.

I'm guessing you like this feature and can use it reliably? Do you think you would prefer it to having a separate cymbal element that you can add to your kit, position where you want, and hit to trigger choked cymbal samples?

Re: MIDI Cymbal Choke

PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 12:46 pm
by nickynoodles
Hi Richard,

Thanks for the reply. I'm a beginner drummer but I definitely like the feature and used it when I was playing with Aerodrums' samples; it's essential for some songs.

Yes, I think a separate cymbal element could work better in terms of positioning flexibility. What I'm not sure about is actually having to hit it rather than quickly moving the stick into it. I found I could hit the left crash and choke in almost one movement. Hit then 'swipe' left.

I suppose, for me, the best option would be a circular cymbal choke zone that I can place, but that just requires a marker moved into it, not hit. I'm a software engineer myself, so I know these things are probably easier said than done :)
How about starting a poll so some more advanced drummers can weigh in?

Thanks for the great work on Aerodrums btw, I'm really enjoying learning with it.

Re: MIDI Cymbal Choke

PostPosted: Thu Nov 12, 2015 1:10 pm
by nickynoodles
After a bit more thought, I think my best scenario would look like:

- There are various sized cymbal choke kit elements. "10-inch cymbal choke zone, ... ,20-inch cymbal choke zone etc"
- These are placed like normal kit elements
- They are triggered when a marker moves into their zone, not on a hit
- They send midi :)
- When you place them, they are always underneath any other kit elements

Re: MIDI Cymbal Choke

PostPosted: Mon Nov 16, 2015 10:38 pm
by Richard
Thanks a lot for the feedback. The main motivation behind the current choke feature was to allow you to use natural one-handed and two-handed cymbal choking gestures. It works but at the cost of using up some of the playable space for the cymbal choking zones. Some of the alternative ideas were to have a choke pedal, a choke zone element (what you described) and new elements that would just trigger choked cymbal samples. The main difference between the last two options is timing; the first ones lets you decide when to choke whereas in the second the timing is "baked" into the samples. Can you comment on how important timing is to you when choking crash you just hit and grab or is the grab timed?

Re: MIDI Cymbal Choke

PostPosted: Tue Nov 17, 2015 1:25 pm
by nickynoodles
I think the 'grab' needs to be timed ideally. Two songs I'm doing a poor job of learning at the moment start with choked cymbals: Jesus of Suburbia by Green Day and Always by Blink 182.

On the Green Day track you do four sustained cymbal hits then choke on the next beat, on the Blink 182, grab as fast as you can.

My Aerodrums kit has 5 cymbals and I've found 5 or 6 to be my individual limit where I can hit each one reliably without looking at the screen.
If each cymbal had a "choked" counterpart, I'd need to scale back to 3 normal cymbals and 2 choked. I still couldn't play the Green Day track with that though.

Of course, I suppose one option is to let the user decide. You might have a list of elements like this:

- 18-inch Crash
- 18-inch Choked Crash
- 18-inch Cymbal Choke Zone

Re: MIDI Cymbal Choke

PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2016 1:13 pm
I don't even have my kit yet but I have been thinking about several elements of drumming that may not work with this concept. I am very excited to work with this product.
I am not an engineer but I am a long time and pretty capable drummer. What if choking the cymbal was simply holding the stick still in the "zone" of the cymbal strike would be? Again I am not familiar with the product yet. I do play many genres and I can't recall ever needing to choke my ride.
Does the program currently offer a way to choke cymbals?

Re: MIDI Cymbal Choke

PostPosted: Fri Mar 11, 2016 1:04 pm
by Richard
There is an experimental cymbal choking feature in the current version of Aerodrums. Basically there are two adjustable zones on either side of you and whenever a drum stick enters one of these regions, all cymbals will be choked. To a certain extent this allows some natural choking gestures such as hitting a crash on the left of your kit with your right hand and choking it with your left hand (the stick will point towards the left and enter the choke zone). We're still undecided though if this is the best mechanic...we have other ideas that we'd like to experiment with.